Kommentare zu: Maybe Sony bought Gracenote so that Apples iPhone 2.0 will not be able to listen http://www.line-of-reasoning.com/interesting-links/maybe-sony-bought-gracenote-so-that-apples-iphone-20-will-not-be-able-to-listen-2/ line of reasoning Wed, 27 Aug 2008 23:23:22 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.5.1 Von: Ralf Scharnetzki http://www.line-of-reasoning.com/interesting-links/maybe-sony-bought-gracenote-so-that-apples-iphone-20-will-not-be-able-to-listen-2/#comment-1702 Ralf Scharnetzki Fri, 25 Jul 2008 21:23:22 +0000 http://www.line-of-reasoning.com/?p=78#comment-1702 We are closing a funny loop here: Erica Sadun (developer of Listen.app based on Gracenotes service) posted the news here http://www.tuaw.com/2008/07/10/shazam-for-the-iphone/. Shazam for iPhone is available to recognize songs. Erica is speculating that the service will cost you between $5 to $10 for a month. We are closing a funny loop here: Erica Sadun (developer of Listen.app based on Gracenotes service) posted the news here http://www.tuaw.com/2008/07/10/shazam-for-the-iphone/. Shazam for iPhone is available to recognize songs. Erica is speculating that the service will cost you between $5 to $10 for a month.

]]> Von: Tyler http://www.line-of-reasoning.com/interesting-links/maybe-sony-bought-gracenote-so-that-apples-iphone-20-will-not-be-able-to-listen-2/#comment-1612 Tyler Mon, 12 May 2008 13:15:15 +0000 http://www.line-of-reasoning.com/?p=78#comment-1612 Great post about the history of Gracenote by "knows" at http://www.nerdlogger.com/2008/04/and-battle-continue.html Slashdot's Firehose has picked it up http://slashdot.org/firehose.pl?op=view&id=666026 Great post about the history of Gracenote by “knows” at
http://www.nerdlogger.com/2008/04/and-battle-continue.html

Slashdot’s Firehose has picked it up
http://slashdot.org/firehose.pl?op=view&id=666026

]]> Von: Smite http://www.line-of-reasoning.com/interesting-links/maybe-sony-bought-gracenote-so-that-apples-iphone-20-will-not-be-able-to-listen-2/#comment-1593 Smite Sat, 10 May 2008 07:25:58 +0000 http://www.line-of-reasoning.com/?p=78#comment-1593 Ralf, your posts are well taken. Privacy is a core issue. Gracenote's "Privacy Policy" is a farce. Sony has bought itself an excellent way to propagate its agenda of DRM and full control. BurtonBoy, good point. Gracenote can change its policy at will. Gracenote is a company with a history of rewriting the news to fit its own agenda: "Gracenote Founder Rewriting History At Wikipedia" http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=06/12/02/1955245 What's to keep these Gracenote guys from rewriting all their policies to fit their new Sony agenda? The Steve Scherf in the Slashdot article is the same guy who sold the formerly GPL'd cddb to make some bucks on the backs of his community's efforts: "CDDB Joins The Bad Patent Club" http://yro.slashdot.org/yro/00/12/08/2254214.shtml?tid=155 Then Scherf and pals started to use the community information to police copyrights by selling their data to help close down the original Napster: "Dear CDDB Users: Thanks For Helping The RIAA!" http://slashdot.org/articles/01/03/14/043230.shtml They followed up by bringing lawsuits to their former customers like Roxio who tried to switch to freedb: "Gracenote Sues Roxio Over Switch to Free Song Database" http://slashdot.org/articles/01/05/11/1247214.shtml They also sued former customers for creating their own substitute for CDDB - MusicMatch: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Gracenote#Gracenote_vs_Musicmatch Gracenote has a controversial history. The "Oh, let's just trust them" approach that Guesser suggests is terrifying indeed. Ralf, your posts are well taken. Privacy is a core issue. Gracenote’s “Privacy Policy” is a farce. Sony has bought itself an excellent way to propagate its agenda of DRM and full control.

BurtonBoy, good point. Gracenote can change its policy at will. Gracenote is a company with a history of rewriting the news to fit its own agenda:

“Gracenote Founder Rewriting History At Wikipedia”
http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=06/12/02/1955245

What’s to keep these Gracenote guys from rewriting all their policies to fit their new Sony agenda? The Steve Scherf in the Slashdot article is the same guy who sold the formerly GPL’d cddb to make some bucks on the backs of his community’s efforts:

“CDDB Joins The Bad Patent Club”
http://yro.slashdot.org/yro/00/12/08/2254214.shtml?tid=155

Then Scherf and pals started to use the community information to police copyrights by selling their data to help close down the original Napster:

“Dear CDDB Users: Thanks For Helping The RIAA!”
http://slashdot.org/articles/01/03/14/043230.shtml

They followed up by bringing lawsuits to their former customers like Roxio who tried to switch to freedb:

“Gracenote Sues Roxio Over Switch to Free Song Database”
http://slashdot.org/articles/01/05/11/1247214.shtml

They also sued former customers for creating their own substitute for CDDB - MusicMatch:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Gracenote#Gracenote_vs_Musicmatch

Gracenote has a controversial history. The “Oh, let’s just trust them” approach that Guesser suggests is terrifying indeed.

]]> Von: Ralf Scharnetzki http://www.line-of-reasoning.com/interesting-links/maybe-sony-bought-gracenote-so-that-apples-iphone-20-will-not-be-able-to-listen-2/#comment-1565 Ralf Scharnetzki Wed, 07 May 2008 04:21:07 +0000 http://www.line-of-reasoning.com/?p=78#comment-1565 Everything is possible. Whenever there is information related to you there are privacy and security issues. We are touching on those topics in this blog regularly, examples see here http://www.line-of-reasoning.com/interesting-links/touching-on-the-central-dualism-of-the-information-age-what-information-is-available-to-you-versus-what-information-are-you-making-available-or-is-available-about-you-to-others/ and here http://www.line-of-reasoning.com/issues/be-aware-you-will-not-be-able-to-delete-from-google-docs-any-image-embedded-in-your-presentations/ . Everything is possible. Whenever there is information related to you there are privacy and security issues. We are touching on those topics in this blog regularly, examples see here http://www.line-of-reasoning.com/interesting-links/touching-on-the-central-dualism-of-the-information-age-what-information-is-available-to-you-versus-what-information-are-you-making-available-or-is-available-about-you-to-others/ and here http://www.line-of-reasoning.com/issues/be-aware-you-will-not-be-able-to-delete-from-google-docs-any-image-embedded-in-your-presentations/ .

]]> Von: BurtonBoy http://www.line-of-reasoning.com/interesting-links/maybe-sony-bought-gracenote-so-that-apples-iphone-20-will-not-be-able-to-listen-2/#comment-1558 BurtonBoy Tue, 06 May 2008 07:41:45 +0000 http://www.line-of-reasoning.com/?p=78#comment-1558 @ Guesser Gracenote updated its privacy policy on April 8th, and states that they can update it merely by changing the policy statement on their site. The statement itself is vague and cleverly avoids saying that IP addresses are deleted outright. @ Smite I agree. There is cause to be concerned. @Ralf Another possible theory to investigate is, "Sony bought Gracenote to prevent music piracy." What do you think? @ Guesser
Gracenote updated its privacy policy on April 8th, and states that they can update it merely by changing the policy statement on their site. The statement itself is vague and cleverly avoids saying that IP addresses are deleted outright.

@ Smite
I agree. There is cause to be concerned.

@Ralf
Another possible theory to investigate is,

“Sony bought Gracenote to prevent music piracy.”

What do you think?

]]> Von: Smite http://www.line-of-reasoning.com/interesting-links/maybe-sony-bought-gracenote-so-that-apples-iphone-20-will-not-be-able-to-listen-2/#comment-1556 Smite Tue, 06 May 2008 04:28:48 +0000 http://www.line-of-reasoning.com/?p=78#comment-1556 I just read the policy. It certainly would not be difficult for Sony to determine that IP addresses are required for security purposes under the policy, and then retain them for as long as they need to file lawsuits. It's not clear how long IP addresses are being retained and for what uses they are being used in the policy. There is hardly a need to "radically" change the policy as you indicate. Your examples of Doubleclick and Google are a red herring. Did you do this intentionally? They are not core members of the RIAA who support lawsuits against consumers; did not issue the rootkit; do not repeatedly sue their former customers, and are far less controversial than Gracenote overall. The policy does nothing to reduce my fear. Do you work at Gracenote, Sony, or just a consultant for them? I just read the policy. It certainly would not be difficult for Sony to determine that IP addresses are required for security purposes under the policy, and then retain them for as long as they need to file lawsuits. It’s not clear how long IP addresses are being retained and for what uses they are being used in the policy.

There is hardly a need to “radically” change the policy as you indicate.

Your examples of Doubleclick and Google are a red herring. Did you do this intentionally? They are not core members of the RIAA who support lawsuits against consumers; did not issue the rootkit; do not repeatedly sue their former customers, and are far less controversial than Gracenote overall.

The policy does nothing to reduce my fear.

Do you work at Gracenote, Sony, or just a consultant for them?

]]> Von: Guesser http://www.line-of-reasoning.com/interesting-links/maybe-sony-bought-gracenote-so-that-apples-iphone-20-will-not-be-able-to-listen-2/#comment-1552 Guesser Mon, 05 May 2008 20:10:57 +0000 http://www.line-of-reasoning.com/?p=78#comment-1552 Terrifying? Really? Compared to what Doubleclick/Google or credit card companies, etc., know about you, I'm having trouble being terrified. Take a look at their privacy policy: http://www.gracenote.com/company_info/privacy/musicid-privacy/ No IP address retention, no personally identifiable information. Sony would have to radically change Gracenote's policy for there to be any privacy concerns, in my opinion. This privacy policy seems way better than the majority of the privacy policies from my favorite services and websites. Keep an eye to see if their policy changes, I suppose. If not, I wouldn't worry. If any of the major provisions change, then perhaps it's time for concern. Terrifying? Really? Compared to what Doubleclick/Google or credit card companies, etc., know about you, I’m having trouble being terrified. Take a look at their privacy policy:

http://www.gracenote.com/company_info/privacy/musicid-privacy/

No IP address retention, no personally identifiable information. Sony would have to radically change Gracenote’s policy for there to be any privacy concerns, in my opinion. This privacy policy seems way better than the majority of the privacy policies from my favorite services and websites.

Keep an eye to see if their policy changes, I suppose. If not, I wouldn’t worry. If any of the major provisions change, then perhaps it’s time for concern.

]]> Von: Smite http://www.line-of-reasoning.com/interesting-links/maybe-sony-bought-gracenote-so-that-apples-iphone-20-will-not-be-able-to-listen-2/#comment-1549 Smite Mon, 05 May 2008 14:36:58 +0000 http://www.line-of-reasoning.com/?p=78#comment-1549 The IBM report you linked is good. The "Digital Persona" chapter is especially relevant in this case. Sony may want to own your profile via Gracenote. This is terrifying because they are people who brought us rootkit, and support the RIAA lawsuits. Perhaps this is what they are trying to accomplish with Gracenote? The ramifications are terrifying. The IBM report you linked is good. The “Digital Persona” chapter is especially relevant in this case. Sony may want to own your profile via Gracenote. This is terrifying because they are people who brought us rootkit, and support the RIAA lawsuits. Perhaps this is what they are trying to accomplish with Gracenote? The ramifications are terrifying.

]]> Von: Ralf Scharnetzki http://www.line-of-reasoning.com/interesting-links/maybe-sony-bought-gracenote-so-that-apples-iphone-20-will-not-be-able-to-listen-2/#comment-1536 Ralf Scharnetzki Sun, 04 May 2008 13:46:25 +0000 http://www.line-of-reasoning.com/?p=78#comment-1536 Here the link to the IBM Global Innovation Outlook Media+Content (GIO 3.0) that works: http://www.ibm.com/ibm/ideasfromibm/us/media/111907/index.shtml Here the link to the IBM Global Innovation Outlook Media+Content (GIO 3.0) that works:

http://www.ibm.com/ibm/ideasfromibm/us/media/111907/index.shtml

]]> Von: Ralf Scharnetzki http://www.line-of-reasoning.com/interesting-links/maybe-sony-bought-gracenote-so-that-apples-iphone-20-will-not-be-able-to-listen-2/#comment-1535 Ralf Scharnetzki Sun, 04 May 2008 13:40:48 +0000 http://www.line-of-reasoning.com/?p=78#comment-1535 As long as you look at music recognition as just one of many features of a mobile device I agree, the Sony investment and our points above are somehow difficult to accept. And Guesser, you are right, it would be stupid from Sony to spend this amount of money to "just hurt Apple a little". But looking from a (Sony) CEO level at the deep relation between context and content in a (more and more) information driven economy even an investment of $260M into Gracenote can make mid term very much sense. Maybe we will find the time to discuss this to a greater level of detail in another post, until then this IBM GIO 3.0 report is pointing imho into the right direction: "Chapter 3 - Context is King" + "Chapter 4 - Going Mobile" -> Link: http://domino.watson.ibm.com/comm/www_innovate.nsf/images/gio-new-media/$FILE/gio_media_and_content_report_final.pdf As long as you look at music recognition as just one of many features of a mobile device I agree, the Sony investment and our points above are somehow difficult to accept. And Guesser, you are right, it would be stupid from Sony to spend this amount of money to “just hurt Apple a little”. But looking from a (Sony) CEO level at the deep relation between context and content in a (more and more) information driven economy even an investment of $260M into Gracenote can make mid term very much sense. Maybe we will find the time to discuss this to a greater level of detail in another post, until then this IBM GIO 3.0 report is pointing imho into the right direction: “Chapter 3 - Context is King” + “Chapter 4 - Going Mobile” -> Link: http://domino.watson.ibm.com/comm/www_innovate.nsf/images/gio-new-media/FILE/gio_media_and_content_report_final.pdf

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